Cataclysm: Dark Days Ahead - Official Forums

Cataclysm: Dark Days Ahead => Announcements => Topic started by: Soron on June 11, 2013, 04:15:53 AM

Title: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: Soron on June 11, 2013, 04:15:53 AM
We've just updated the bleeding edge Windows link, and have added a second link: SDL builds. It's a different way to render the game, and we're hoping that it will eliminate some of the performance issues that we hear about from Windows users. At the very least, SDL bugs are things that our main Linux devs can potentially fix, which is an improvement.

The front page of the website has links for both the traditional rendering system (http://ci.narc.ro/job/Cataclysm-Win32/lastSuccessfulBuild/artifact/cataclysmdda-0.6.zip) ("GDI", I'm told), and the new SDL-based build (http://ci.narc.ro/job/Cataclysm-Win32-SDL/lastSuccessfulBuild/artifact/cataclysmdda-0.6.zip).

If anyone wants to help us out, we would greatly appreciate hearing feedback about performance differences between the two versions - as well as the usual desire to receive bug reports, of course ;).

Enjoy!
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: AerialK7 on June 11, 2013, 04:47:07 AM
Put it up on the facebook page.

HERES SOME MOAR ATTENTION
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: Dzlan on June 11, 2013, 05:35:23 AM
Are there only meant to be Performance differences? Is SDL meant to be better?
If so, I might move over to using it, just to help with feedback.
But, is it, the Nightly builds, or the full updates or what?
Can some more info be given about what the SDL version is for please? And what is included? (or meant to be)
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: Clayton on June 11, 2013, 05:36:57 AM
There's definitely a vast improvement in performance, at least for me. Also, the new font looks very nice. Good job! One question, though: On the map screen I noticed a level indicator, "Level: 0" what is that for? I don't think I've noticed it before.
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: Dzlan on June 11, 2013, 05:41:46 AM
Oh, I see that in the latest nightly build too.

Edit: Oh, and now... This morning, I had the best luck. Time for it all to be for nothing, cause I guess, I'm going with the SDL version.

Edit: If SDL does perform better... Are you going to actually work on two different modes? Is there an advantage for the other one?
Wouldn't it be easier to on your part to work on just the SDL version? To be honest, I'm not very well educated in this area, so I might sound like a damn idiot. But I'm interested in the answer to that.

Another Edit: This time, about problems. I'm in the options, might just be me... But the text is hurting my eyes a bit, too be honest... Might just have to get used to it, sorry if its just me... Can anyone else confirm? I'm usually used to screens and stuff too. (Edit) Nope it's just in the options menu.
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: Soron on June 11, 2013, 05:50:09 AM
The SDL build is presently feature-identical with the non-SDL build, assuming they're both the same version (i.e., bleeding edge SDL is the same as bleeding edge GDI; it's not the same as 0.5, obviously). The SDL build may eventually become more full-featured than the GDI build (especially when we eventually get tiles support - that will be SDL-based), but for now, I mainly expect performance differences.

One question, though: On the map screen I noticed a level indicator, "Level: 0" what is that for? I don't think I've noticed it before.

That's the level of the current map - it was added when we added the ability to examine higher/lower levels (e.g., so that you can be in sewer system, and easily cross-reference the sewers with the above ground terrain).
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: Slax on June 11, 2013, 06:06:45 AM
Can't switch fonts, which is unfortunate.
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: Soron on June 11, 2013, 06:13:32 AM
You *should* be able to load any TTF font that you stick in the data/font/ directory. I'm not sure how we'd access system fonts in Windows SDL builds, though, which is a mark in favor of keeping the old rendering method around, at least for now.
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: Dzlan on June 11, 2013, 06:19:27 AM
I notice this one has been updated too? I mean, I don't think, Zombies were in houses randomly in the last nightly build from a couple of nights ago...
Though, I could have just randomly encountered a zombie in the first house I searched.
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: Soron on June 11, 2013, 06:27:11 AM
Yeah, the nightlies were broken for a while (they never got pointed to the new Github repository when we recently moved from DarklingWolf's personal repo, to a shared repo). So there's about a week's backlog of changes that will be in both of the bleeding edge versions linked from the main page.
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: Slax on June 11, 2013, 06:30:54 AM
Hm. You may want to consult LazyCat on the font matter. His SDL version seems to be all figured out.
As it is right now, cootue_curses_square_16x16.ttf is all sorts of screwed up. Same with the defaults. Just looks... wonky.
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: Dzlan on June 11, 2013, 06:47:40 AM
Sweet, so I'm looking forwards to a lot of new features then : ) Better keep my eyes and ears open.
Now, this should be fun.
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: Justice on June 11, 2013, 06:49:27 AM
@Dzlan If you think that's new, then be sure to press [Page Down] on the map screen, too. ;)
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: Dzlan on June 11, 2013, 07:01:49 AM
Sweet! So this prob means no more maps being wiped out.
Also, feedback on performance...  Defenitely an increase. No more lag when running.
Need to get used to that.
Can't wait to test out the new vehicle physics.
:)

P.S.
Not sure if it was fixed yet, but saving and loading while zombies are on screen caused them to move when loading game and sometimes multiply. (I think so) I'ma go try that out next time I encounter some.
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: Soron on June 11, 2013, 07:18:27 AM
Save/load multiplication of enemies was fixed recently (testing the fixed version vs. the non-fixed version was pretty dramatic). I don't think the position-changing enemies have been addressed, though.
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: Dzlan on June 11, 2013, 07:19:28 AM
Oh, well, they just moved one step as if I had skipped my turn. Nothing too serious there.

OH WOW!!! So, before, reading was literally 20 seconds, skill increase to 13%, another 20 seconds, skill increase to 19%
Now, it is almost instant. Just Bam! 13% Bam 19% Bam 24%.
I must say, that is a definite improvement.
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: ajwilli1 on June 11, 2013, 07:25:51 AM
Well it sounds like all the bugs are ironed out midnight seems like a good time to play some new cataclysm.
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: Dzlan on June 11, 2013, 07:31:50 AM
Haha, Yeah. I think this has been a major step forwards for Cataclysm. Doing a great job. And I must give a big thanks to the devs for this too, cause Cataclysm has given me a huge amount of fun. Not just playing it, but the stories I make in it and of course, I'm writing a small novel based on Cataclysm, to help refine my writing skills. Currently 7 pages in, but when it's complete I'll put it up online for others to read. : )
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: ajwilli1 on June 11, 2013, 07:38:00 AM
I'll have to give a read then. I do agree with you that its about making stories then sharing them with other people or turning them into novels or any other form of media, and in that sense Cataclysm becomes more of a source of inspiration than a rougelike (but still is a great rougelike). This is what most post-apocalyptic games should be like creating your own story while surviving in a harsh unforgiving world.
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: Dzlan on June 11, 2013, 07:44:13 AM
Yes, that is definitely my favorite part of Cataclysm and Dwarf Fortress. Making your own stories and tales. A true Rogue Like game.
Oh and of course the ASCII graphics. (Like a novel, your mind has to create the visuals).
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: Dzlan on June 11, 2013, 09:35:07 AM
Thought I'd better ask...  : )
How often will the SDL version be updated? Does it feature nightly builds too? And is that every night?
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: Wayfarer on June 11, 2013, 09:36:42 AM
Hmm...I could be retarded, but I'm stuck on a motorcycle.  "e" just goes to examine, not exit vehicle.
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: ajwilli1 on June 11, 2013, 09:40:42 AM
When you hit "e" try exiting where the vehicle isnt

example:

               0
               ^
          <--@-->
               0




           0       ^
             ^    /
               @/
             /     0
           /
         v
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: Wayfarer on June 11, 2013, 09:45:55 AM
Tried all directions.  Very much stuck.  It could be because it's one of those vehicle-crashed-into-another-vehicle scenarios.  Front wheel area is inside a car, jumped on to see if it had an engine and could move it, whatever, just to experiment.
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: ajwilli1 on June 11, 2013, 09:47:36 AM
Oh I have had that happen to me before only I hit the gas and got ejected into a concrete wall.
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: Soron on June 11, 2013, 09:53:06 AM
Both the bleeding edge/experimental builds will be updated within minutes of new changes being approved by one of the maintainers. That's much more frequently than nightly, btw ;).

Once we're ready to release 0.6, I'd like to provide both the GDI and SDL versions - especially if the SDL build is indeed massively faster, as it seems to be.

Hmm...I could be retarded, but I'm stuck on a motorcycle.  "e" just goes to examine, not exit vehicle.

The key for exiting vehicles was recently remapped (leaving it on 'e'xamine was a little funky). It's now in the vehicle control menu, accessible by default from '^'. You may need to go into the keymap page ('?', '2') to set that keymap up if you don't have it for some reason (e.g., if you copied over your old keymap file).
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: Slax on June 11, 2013, 10:11:07 AM
^ is sort of a tricky thing on some keyboards, mine included. Shift+^ key, then space. Otherwise it doesn't register.
You get used to it though. Eventually.
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: Soron on June 11, 2013, 10:15:05 AM
Huh, odd.

May I suggest remapping that key to something else, then?
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: prytoclasm on June 11, 2013, 10:18:03 AM
^ = odd on a lot of keyboards. On a german, french, czech and so on layout you have to press the key "^" and then anything else or it does not work. It's mainly for stuff like "o" + ^ to "ô" and so on, to get chars like î, Û, â. It's used in a lot of 'eastern europe' languages too, for example.
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: Slax on June 11, 2013, 10:32:07 AM
Huh, odd.

May I suggest remapping that key to something else, then?
Nah, I'm used to it by now. Just thinking that this may become a future problem for other people.

Oh, and...
Quote
Both the bleeding edge/experimental builds will be updated within minutes of new changes being approved by one of the maintainers. That's much more frequently than nightly, btw ;).
Fantastic!
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: Soron on June 11, 2013, 10:33:37 AM
Ah, that's good to know. We should probably look into common behavior with international keyboards... and maybe make sure we can capture ctrl+key stuff, as well, because we are seriously running low on keys!
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: Slax on June 11, 2013, 10:42:02 AM
Yeah, ctrl would definitely help out.
Ctrl+...
qwer
asdf
zxcg
Prime targets for the most useful actions.
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: prytoclasm on June 11, 2013, 10:54:34 AM
When I think back, in System Shock 2 you could use most ctrl-alt-shift combinations. I used 1, shift-1, ctrl-1, alt-1, ctrl-alt-1, shift-alt-1 and shift-ctrl-1 for actions I always use. In the end I had everything on a few keys. Though, a few crashed the game and had to be remapped.
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: 100Rads on June 11, 2013, 11:32:28 AM
This version is really awesome, everything runs smoothly without lagging and the random stutters, and the new font is so sexy ;)
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: Wayfarer on June 11, 2013, 12:54:29 PM
Oh but other than not realising the exit vehicle thing before, this version is boss.  Fast as.

yeah, it must be challenging to map controls.  Done pretty well so far though!
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: fatkat61 on June 11, 2013, 01:00:51 PM
there is definitely a performance boost with the SDL version, which is nice, not that the occasional stutter bothered me. and I love the new font. much more vibrant. I can see everything much better.
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: Mdnthrvst on June 11, 2013, 01:31:35 PM
No Terminus, no sale. This is not the font that Cataclysm should be rendered in.

I don't care one bit for performance boosts if Cataclysm doesn't look like itself. Please make it possible to replicate the look of the old version perfectly, and if you can't, keep that thing updated so I can play it instead.
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: Slax on June 11, 2013, 02:20:27 PM
Here's a visual representation (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7N7DVYzxUVo) of the visual glitches I'm getting.
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: dwarfhoplite on June 11, 2013, 02:56:50 PM
Has something about zombie spawns changed? I tried  some 10 characters and none of them could get close to the nearest house on the initial raid to a settlement without being assaulted by a horde of zombies. If not, what would be optimal zombie spawn settings to make it as forgiving as possible?

The new system runs fantastically.
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: DBrickShaw on June 11, 2013, 04:07:07 PM
Awesome news!

How would I go about building the SDL version from source? I'm already fairly familiar with building the Windows binary (using MinGW), but I'm not sure how the makefile should be modified to build the SDL version (or is there a separate branch for that code somewhere?).
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: Narc on June 11, 2013, 04:23:54 PM
How would I go about building the SDL version from source? I'm already fairly familiar with building the Windows binary (using MinGW), but I'm not sure how the makefile should be modified to build the SDL version (or is there a separate branch for that code somewhere?).
You'll want to add TILES=1 to your make command. The Makefile can build all the versions now (and the experimentals are both being cross-compiled on a Linux system). However, note the SDL version has more dependencies (specifically, SDL and SDL_ttf), and those in turn have some dependencies; you may or may not need to resolve them.

Also, the TILES=1 may change to SDL=1 in the near future, so read the Makefile comments to be sure.

Just in case you're curious, here's what I have currently for the Jenkins SDL build (compiled on Linux for a Win32 target):
Code: [Select]
make CROSS=/home/narc/src/mxe/usr/bin/i686-pc-mingw32- TILES=1 clean

export LDFLAGS="${LDFLAGS} -s"
export CXXFLAGS="-Os -I/home/narc/src/mxe/usr/i686-pc-mingw32/include/SDL"
make CROSS=/home/narc/src/mxe/usr/bin/i686-pc-mingw32- TILES=1 DEBUG= -j4

make CROSS=/home/narc/src/mxe/usr/bin/i686-pc-mingw32- TILES=1 bindist
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: kenoxite on June 11, 2013, 06:25:20 PM
I've just played for a few minutes with this SDL thing, but looks quite promising. And just about when I started to complain about performance issues on Windows.

BTW, there's no  link in the main site to the linux32 nightly builds. Is the same link as before and just forgot about it or have you stopped publishing nightly builds for it?
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: GlyphGryph on June 11, 2013, 06:31:40 PM
From our experience, they weren't seeing much use - it's pretty trivial to build yourself on linux, and most people know how.

Also, no one provided me with a link for that. :P

I do need to stick back up the linux compiling guide though.
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: kenoxite on June 11, 2013, 06:35:48 PM
Ok. I was about to update the Download wiki page and wasn't sure about what to do with that.

Will those new windows builds be updated at the same time as before? (which was ~5am UTC+1)
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: Narc on June 11, 2013, 06:39:21 PM
Ok. I was about to update the Download wiki page and wasn't sure about what to do with that.

Will those new windows builds be updated at the same time as before? (which was ~5am UTC+1)
They update when stuff gets pushed to the main Git, assuming nothing was added that would make them stop compiling correctly.

Is there any demand for linux32 builds? I could add that to the jenkins quite easily, I think.
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: GlyphGryph on June 11, 2013, 06:44:11 PM
Will those new windows builds be updated at the same time as before? (which was ~5am UTC+1)
These are now instant edge code builds rather than nightly, so no, not at the same time. The link, however, should be static.

Also, Narc, yeah I would say linux32 would probably be a good idea.
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: kenoxite on June 11, 2013, 06:47:28 PM
Thanks for the info.
I've updated the download page (http://www.wiki.cataclysmdda.com/index.php?title=Download#Nightly_builds) in the wiki accordingly.
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: nadia911 on June 11, 2013, 07:23:32 PM
I would like to know how I can do to use the font Pixel-font7

http://www.dafont.com/pixel-font7.font (http://www.dafont.com/pixel-font7.font)

Thanks
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: Narc on June 11, 2013, 07:31:55 PM
Also, Narc, yeah I would say linux32 would probably be a good idea.
Okay, have a Linux ncurses build (http://ci.narc.ro/job/Cataclysm-Lin32/lastSuccessfulBuild/artifact/cataclysmdda-0.5.tar.gz) and a Linux SDL build (http://ci.narc.ro/job/Cataclysm-Lin32-SDL/lastSuccessfulBuild/artifact/cataclysmdda-0.5.tar.gz). Also, turns out Ubuntu has really really old SDL_ttf-dev. Ugh.
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: Dzlan on June 11, 2013, 08:49:28 PM
Ah, that's good to know. We should probably look into common behavior with international keyboards... and maybe make sure we can capture ctrl+key stuff, as well, because we are seriously running low on keys!

Can you not do it DF style where the keys are a-z (or a-k or whatever) on one page and on the second page, resets (a-z) again?
Means, we don't get crap like [ and { Which I keep mixing up and even \ and | and Control is even more annoying then Shift.

Just an idea though. If not, then I guess Control will need to be a solution.
And has the mappings for too many bionics been fixed?
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: kenoxite on June 11, 2013, 09:02:09 PM
I would like to know how I can do to use the font Pixel-font7
To change the default font simply replace the default one, found in data\font, with the one of your choice (simply delete the existing fixedsys.ttf one and copy on that folder the one you want to use - Pixel-font7).
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: Drakasin on June 11, 2013, 09:29:20 PM
The SDL version is WAY WAY WAY WAY WAY WAY better than the "normal" one. The performance is top notch. Such fluidness after two years of stuttering makes me immensely happy.
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: nadia911 on June 12, 2013, 12:56:03 AM
I would like to know how I can do to use the font Pixel-font7
To change the default font simply replace the default one, found in data\font, with the one of your choice (simply delete the existing fixedsys.ttf one and copy on that folder the one you want to use - Pixel-font7).

I did so, but takes no resizing, only small...
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: esran on June 12, 2013, 01:34:09 AM
everything is way way better in sdl. sleeping still freezes the game for like 20 seconds though. my mouse turns into a  blue circle, the screen tints white, everything becomes unclickable, and then everythings fine again.
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: utunnels on June 12, 2013, 01:48:40 AM
In that case your CPU just can't handle it quickly.

Sleep is technologically a fast forward without screen refresh, like you hold "." for a couple of minutes normally. Everything has to be calculated.

I would like to know how I can do to use the font Pixel-font7
To change the default font simply replace the default one, found in data\font, with the one of your choice (simply delete the existing fixedsys.ttf one and copy on that folder the one you want to use - Pixel-font7).

I did so, but takes no resizing, only small...


IIRC you can add another line in data/FONTDATA to define the actually font size, for example:


your font file
8
16
15

Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: nadia911 on June 12, 2013, 02:01:41 AM
OK, I did that too, but does not change the font size

In previous versions did not have this problem

Thanks anyway
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: utunnels on June 12, 2013, 02:16:50 AM
That is odd. Because I see the code on github already contains the change.
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: utunnels on June 12, 2013, 03:42:42 AM
Well I downloaded that font from dafont. The seems the two .fon files don't resize but the ttf file actually resizes.

BTW, the SDL version supports absolute path, like

D:\temp\DDA\data\font\pixel font-7.ttf
8
16
16


I usually play with lucide console, it is the default font for cygwin I think.

c:\windows\fonts\lucon.ttf
8
16
14

Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: Slax on June 12, 2013, 05:13:10 AM
your font file
8
16
15
Didn't know there were 3 values. Seems to have cleared up some of the screwy graphics I've been seeing.
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: ajwilli1 on June 12, 2013, 06:30:00 AM
ok there's this weird glitch that when I sleep it "crashes" and then my character wakes up. basically all it does is up in the top part of the window where the name of the program is it just says not responding and after a few seconds it runs again.
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: utunnels on June 12, 2013, 06:33:17 AM
It is not a "crash". The game is just calculating turns.
Although I agress it is better to have a "waiting...." window instead of freeze if it takes longer time on slow pc.
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: Soron on June 12, 2013, 06:51:53 AM
Yeah, it's odd that it's being considered non-responsive. Wonder what's up with that. And I wonder how to make it realize that it's NOT non-responsive...

Actually, I wonder if it's maybe fast computers, not slow ones? Due to it being a tight loop, and all.
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: utunnels on June 12, 2013, 07:21:12 AM
Well on windows 7 it is common. I have lots of games show a non-responsive status on the title bar while loading. The most annoying side effect is the window sometimes goes white or shifts by some pixels.   

It can be fixed by adding some message processing lines in the loop to make the OS assume it is not "dead".
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: Soron on June 12, 2013, 07:28:37 AM
Ah, THAT'S what I was thinking of. Perfect :). So... we just need a getch() or similar during the sleep loop? Which, ironically, will make the GDI version laggier.
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: utunnels on June 12, 2013, 07:33:00 AM
Make a dummy function, for exmaple:


while(loop)
{
    blahblah...
   processmessage(); // let OS handle recent window event
}


If it is a curses version, you can just define an empty macro.



#if has_real_curses
 #define processmessage()
#else
 extern void processmessage();
#endif
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: TheGrifter on June 12, 2013, 07:34:43 AM
Any new moddability in regards to the JSON files in this update?
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: Slax on June 12, 2013, 08:17:28 AM
(http://i.imgur.com/4dHkJ6L.png)
Any idea what might be causing this?
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: utunnels on June 12, 2013, 08:30:36 AM
What is your setting?
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: Slax on June 12, 2013, 08:34:08 AM
SDL,
C:\...\cootue_curses_square_16x16.ttf
16
16
16

(click to show/hide)
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: utunnels on June 12, 2013, 08:46:17 AM
Hmm, looks like the font has a strange baseline value.
How does it look like in ordinary windows version?



Code: [Select]
cataclysmdda-0.5.zip     879 B/s - 290 KB of 4.1 MB, 1 hour left
http://ci.narc.ro/job/Cataclysm-Win32/lastSuccessfulBuild/artifact/cataclysmdda-0.5.zip
Facepalm, my download speed.
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: vultures on June 12, 2013, 10:50:31 AM
It's a pretty girl this SDL, I'm sure the freckles will fade in time. A good effort and a serious playability upgrade, for sure - and I'm blaming Soron. :)
I'll make a run to my 128 meg machine and test it there also. I noticed some one-fifth increase in savegame (disk access-write payback) handling; just curious - how'd you manage that?
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: Soron on June 12, 2013, 10:56:33 AM
Blame/thank utunnels as well - they're responsible for the initial code, I just got it cleaned up for inclusion in mainline.

Also, TheGrifter: no major changes to data files, as far as I'm aware.
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: Máté on June 12, 2013, 01:41:35 PM
^ is sort of a tricky thing on some keyboards, mine included. Shift+^ key, then space. Otherwise it doesn't register.
You get used to it though. Eventually.
For me it's Alt Gr+2, then space...
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: Drakasin on June 12, 2013, 02:18:31 PM
^ is sort of a tricky thing on some keyboards, mine included. Shift+^ key, then space. Otherwise it doesn't register.
You get used to it though. Eventually.
For me it's Alt Gr+2, then space...
Or you can always switch to enUS keyboard like I do with my czech keyboard.
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: Máté on June 12, 2013, 02:33:33 PM
^ is sort of a tricky thing on some keyboards, mine included. Shift+^ key, then space. Otherwise it doesn't register.
You get used to it though. Eventually.
For me it's Alt Gr+2, then space...
Or you can always switch to enUS keyboard like I do with my czech keyboard.
But than the layout is so different I can't find anything, but the letters by sight and even then, Z and Y are switched.
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: Scheuche on June 12, 2013, 04:18:59 PM

But than the layout is so different I can't find anything, but the letters by sight and even then, Z and Y are switched.

Its rather easy to learn (at least in my biased opinion). 'Though i use my normal Layout for playing CDD since i got used to it. Maybe i should switch. Decisions, decisions...
(click to show/hide)

Edit: removed one too many quotes...
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: Kevin Granade on June 12, 2013, 04:39:36 PM
I'll make a run to my 128 meg machine and test it there also. I noticed some one-fifth increase in savegame (disk access-write payback) handling; just curious - how'd you manage that?

If you mean faster disk handling (I'm not sure I follow your statement), it's a recent change unrelated to the SDL stuff, where the game was writing out overmaps to disk unnecessarally and very frequently.  Quietust pinpoined it for me and I realized the offending code was unecessary.

So it's not faster, it's doing less disk accesses, which is even better ;D
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: kenoxite on June 12, 2013, 04:41:45 PM
The issue with inaccessible keybinds in non-US keyboards was reported already in a previous version (either 0.4 or 0.5) and was fixed back then. I don't see why they won't be willing and able to fix this new/old issue.

And considering that a lot (the majority?) of CataDDA's player base isn't in or from the US I'm sure they'll get this sorted sooner than later. In fact, I think I saw something about this reported in github a few days back.
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: Máté on June 12, 2013, 05:00:20 PM
But than the layout is so different I can't find anything, but the letters by sight and even then, Z and Y are switched.

Its rather easy to learn (at least in my biased opinion). 'Though i use my normal Layout for playing CDD since i got used to it. Maybe i should switch. Decisions, decisions...
(click to show/hide)
(http://frontype.com/keyboarding/540px-Hungarian-keyboard-layout.svg.png)
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: Slax on June 12, 2013, 07:25:03 PM
Hmm, looks like the font has a strange baseline value.
How does it look like in ordinary windows version?
Doesn't matter what font I use. There's always some sort of strangeness.
(http://i.imgur.com/8eTlbii.png)
See the skewing?

Everything's always been fine (even on MGS SDL binaries) but not with this.
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: Máté on June 12, 2013, 08:40:40 PM
Try linking directly to the font file, it worked for me.
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: vultures on June 12, 2013, 09:09:33 PM
Quote from: Kevin Granade
If you mean faster disk handling (I'm not sure I follow your statement), it's a recent change unrelated to the SDL stuff, where the game was writing out overmaps to disk unnecessarally and very frequently.  Quietust pinpoined it for me and I realized the offending code was unecessary.

So it's not faster, it's doing less disk accesses, which is even better ;D

I'm sure it does, nevertheless as disk-access eats most of the processor time in windows, if the CPU is less loaded / game parses less instructions the slowdowns are not as common. So when you actually instruct the .exe to halt and start intensively writing to disk (thus the term payoff - what's the play aftermath that the game indeed saves) you realise that the processor's memory registers reserved for disk writing take less time to achive the closure.
It's that or you enchanted my proc to +2 saving throws. Heh, saving throws. :P
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: Slax on June 12, 2013, 09:19:41 PM
Try linking directly to the font file, it worked for me.
I am. That's not even the problem here.
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: Máté on June 12, 2013, 09:46:22 PM
I've found a patch of nothing. It was a few squares big, and there were no dots, nothing.
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: Skates on June 12, 2013, 10:57:44 PM
Anyone care to explain why you must use " ^ " in order to disembark cars now? I don't have a problem with it I'm just curious as to why.
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: DBrickShaw on June 12, 2013, 11:50:55 PM
You'll want to add TILES=1 to your make command. The Makefile can build all the versions now (and the experimentals are both being cross-compiled on a Linux system). However, note the SDL version has more dependencies (specifically, SDL and SDL_ttf), and those in turn have some dependencies; you may or may not need to resolve them.

Thanks very much, I've got it up and running now :)

I've found a patch of nothing. It was a few squares big, and there were no dots, nothing.

I've spotted a few of these in the latest version from the git repository as well. Something like this, right?

(click to show/hide)
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: Máté on June 12, 2013, 11:57:25 PM
Yeah. I hoped to fall out of the world, or find Narnia, or something.
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: utunnels on June 13, 2013, 01:23:19 AM
@Slax

Yeah, I'm wondering if it uses a ttf file or just system fonts.

I tried to fix it yesterday and now it displays that cootue_curses_square_16x16.ttf  correctly.
That fixedsys.ttf was downloaded somewhere, maybe we need to find another free font. Terminus seems to be a good choice.

(http://smf.cataclysmdda.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=1770.0;attach=158;image)
------------


Edit*

If you are still testing current version.

fixedsys
8
16
14


This one will fix the baseline issue, for some reason. I need to do more investigation on that why it needs certain size.



Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: i2amroy on June 13, 2013, 03:52:49 AM
I've found a patch of nothing. It was a few squares big, and there were no dots, nothing.
I've spotted a few of these in the latest version from the git repository as well. Something like this, right?
It's been a known bug for a while now (check out git issues #426, #437, and potentially related to #1341). We're pretty sure that the problem lies with some artifacts in the map generation code, but nobody has gotten around to diving in and finding exactly what the problem is yet.
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: ajwilli1 on June 13, 2013, 04:36:56 AM
I've found a patch of nothing. It was a few squares big, and there were no dots, nothing.
I've spotted a few of these in the latest version from the git repository as well. Something like this, right?
It's been a known bug for a while now (check out git issues #426, #437, and potentially related to #1341). We're pretty sure that the problem lies with some artifacts in the map generation code, but nobody has gotten around to diving in and finding exactly what the problem is yet.

I found a spot of nothing and freaked out because I thought they added bottom-less pits until I stepped on the nothing tile.
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: Dzlan on June 13, 2013, 05:01:45 AM
Oh yes... Those, one time, it allowed me into a Locked House, by overlapping the walls and half the bedroom... : ( So some of the loot was gone too...
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: Slax on June 13, 2013, 06:13:00 AM
Thanks for working on it, utunnels.
I can't even get the SDL binary to use installed fonts. I absolutely have to link to them directly.
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: utunnels on June 13, 2013, 06:32:13 AM
Yeah, there are more to do. A ttf file may contains multiple faces, current only the default one is used.  For example, a ttf font may have a bold version and a normal version.

However, getting installed font is another story. The only practicable way I know is iterate all font files under windows/fonts folder and check the family/face names. It is definitely not a cool idea, besides this method is not portable.
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: Dzlan on June 13, 2013, 09:05:55 AM
So reading through the Changelog (YAY, I suddenly found there is a Changelog, Ha!)
A new screen to Organize Worn Equipment???
Woot!

Purifier no longer affects traits from the Char Gen
Does this include, say... traits you can choose at Char gen but didn't?

So, how does the new Armour/Protection work?

Lab coats can be fitted? Clothing can be fitted? As in you can make them fit you? I found several clothing already like that but had no idea you could actually fit clothing yourself.

Has the Furniture changing tiles been fixed?

Man, I love what I've been seeing in here...
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: darth_servo on June 13, 2013, 08:30:38 PM
I've noticed in the latest SDL build that weapons are getting damaged during use now.  I've got multiple stacks of chipped, scratched, and plain wooden javelins in my inventory after a single fight with some zombies.

2 questions:
1. Is the 75-item inventory limit going to be raised now, since similar items that are in different states of disrepair do not stack?
2. Is there a way to repair these damaged items?

Edit:  I started with 10 javelins, and now after 2 fights have 7 left, spread across four different stacks in my inventory (chipped, scratched, cracked, and undamaged).  2 more undamaged javelins are laying on the ground but I can't pick them up because I have hit the inventory item limit: "You're carrying too many items!"

Edit #2: Wow. After 3 fights I'm down to 6 javelins... 4 have disappeared (broken, I assume) after only 1-2 volleys.   I like the idea of items degrading through use, but these things are way too fragile for the effort involved in crafting them. :)
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: Scheuche on June 13, 2013, 10:11:44 PM
Edit:  I started with 10 javelins, and now after 2 fights have 7 left, spread across four different stacks in my inventory (chipped, scratched, cracked, and undamaged).  2 more undamaged javelins are laying on the ground but I can't pick them up because I have hit the inventory item limit: "You're carrying too many items!"

Edit #2: Wow. After 3 fights I'm down to 6 javelins... 4 have disappeared (broken, I assume) after only 1-2 volleys.   I like the idea of items degrading through use, but these things are way too fragile for the effort involved in crafting them. :)

I believe Javelins are better reserved for armored enemies, for general Zombies/etc. throwing Rocks/whatever or using a Slingshot are quite sufficient.
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: darth_servo on June 14, 2013, 12:14:33 AM
I believe Javelins are better reserved for armored enemies, for general Zombies/etc. throwing Rocks/whatever or using a Slingshot are quite sufficient.

Tactics aside, the issue is fragility.  Javelins just happen to be the item type that I noticed the issues with first.

My feedback on the bleeding-edge version that includes item degradation is that it's a little over the top at the moment: my broadsword went from undamaged to disintegrated in 5 hits.

Also, every item has a state of repair at the moment, which means that they stack separately -- even things like medicine/drugs come in damaged versions now.  And "scratched" vitamins don't stack with plain old, undamaged vitamins.

I'm expecting that this is just because it's early-days on the durability system that has been put in place, so it'll get better I'm sure.
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: i2amroy on June 14, 2013, 03:18:32 AM
I'm expecting that this is just because it's early-days on the durability system that has been put in place, so it'll get better I'm sure.
Durability system? I don't know of any pull requests that have added a durability system recently. Sure throwing a javelin can damage it, but I'm not noticing any durability problems with melee combat right now (and to test it I just butchered a whole town with first a broadsword and then a wooden javelin). Where exactly did you download this version, and have you downloaded any other mods?
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: grisamentum on June 14, 2013, 07:05:40 AM
looks like zombies are exploding or something? or stuff is just getting torn up really easily all the time now?
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: KA101 on June 14, 2013, 07:08:37 AM
There was a corpse-smashing routine pulled a few days ago, and I recall someone (I want to say Kevin, but usually if I I say it was him, I'm wrong...) pushing for Gibs to happen.

That fit your observations?
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: Slax on June 14, 2013, 07:40:55 AM
Everything's fine on the font front. Thanks again, utunnels.
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: darth_servo on June 14, 2013, 02:31:34 PM
Durability system? I don't know of any pull requests that have added a durability system recently. Sure throwing a javelin can damage it, but I'm not noticing any durability problems with melee combat right now (and to test it I just butchered a whole town with first a broadsword and then a wooden javelin). Where exactly did you download this version, and have you downloaded any other mods?

From the Windows (Experimental)(SDL) link on the homepage.  The loading screen reads "Version: 0.5-991-g98b1463"

I called it a durability system because that's what I assume it was, since absolutely everything in the version I downloaded now has some sort of durability/condition.  My character has a nicotine addiction and was smoking some "lightly damaged cigarettes" that I picked up off a "bruised zombie corpse" while sorting my javelins into separate piles based on whether they were scratched, cracked, etc. :)  I didn't notice that in the previous day's build, so I assumed it's new.
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: Reservoir on June 14, 2013, 05:08:22 PM
Good to see Windows players can slice zombies now.
Thanks.
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: Morrigi on June 14, 2013, 06:23:28 PM
There was a corpse-smashing routine pulled a few days ago, and I recall someone (I want to say Kevin, but usually if I I say it was him, I'm wrong...) pushing for Gibs to happen.

That fit your observations?
Yeah, shotguns loaded with 00 buck are quite entertaining now. Painting the streets with gore is quite satisfying, but it is slightly over the top.

Also, +1 for said shotgun pulping corpses, that is greatly appreciated.
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: i2amroy on June 15, 2013, 03:47:41 AM
I called it a durability system because that's what I assume it was, since absolutely everything in the version I downloaded now has some sort of durability/condition.  My character has a nicotine addiction and was smoking some "lightly damaged cigarettes" that I picked up off a "bruised zombie corpse" while sorting my javelins into separate piles based on whether they were scratched, cracked, etc. :)  I didn't notice that in the previous day's build, so I assumed it's new.
Sounds more like a new problem with the zombie death item spawn applying to things that it shouldn't be (as well as a possible bug in that thrown items are damaged a little too easily). I'll throw up a git issue report.
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: Máté on June 15, 2013, 05:02:48 AM
Even bear traps get damaged.
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: grisamentum on June 15, 2013, 05:51:41 PM
Yeah, it's a little ridiculous if you ask me. This is one of those things that make sense if it was part of a larger system of stuff but instead it's just spamming a bunch more words on my screen that don't really seem to do anything or interact with any other part of the game.
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: i2amroy on June 16, 2013, 03:13:34 PM
So good news is that we think we've solved the damaged item problem. With any luck it shouldn't be happening anymore.
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: Dzlan on June 16, 2013, 09:06:53 PM
Like, not at all... Or just not so bad?
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: i2amroy on June 16, 2013, 09:40:15 PM
Like, not at all... Or just not so bad?
Not at all. The reason it was happening was due to a weird combination of old/new code when we updated some of the zombie gibbing code, and now said old code has been excised from the codebase. We never intended to add that particular system at all, especially since .6 should be coming out soon and the goal is currently to favor stability over "new content".
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: darth_servo on June 17, 2013, 06:09:39 PM
Seems to be fixed in the version I downloaded this morning. :)
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: Dzlan on June 17, 2013, 09:56:37 PM
Wow that's quite odd. it just happened to create the base of what could ne a nice system.

Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: Kevin Granade on June 17, 2013, 10:06:34 PM
There's already a generic damage system for items, what happened here was that some code for gibbing monsters was applying damage to their drops, which seemed to make sense at first, but in practice ended up causing confusion and exposing inventory stacking issues.

The damage system is still present and ready to be used for various things, although it still has a problem in that the range of damage is really low (0-6), which means it only tracks particularly significan damage.  If the scale was a coupla hundred, we could have various items accumulate damage over time, which would make things work more reasonably.
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: Dzlan on June 18, 2013, 10:57:11 AM
Haha Yeah, as long as their is a better way for Stacking Items of different qualities.
Maybe, say you have d-Spear and i-Cracked Spear
Instead just d-Spear and when selected it comes up with a new menu
[Spear]
a-Spear
b-Cracked Spear

Something like that maybe? So slect spear then select the one of a specific quality afterwards?
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: Nighthawk on June 18, 2013, 12:27:39 PM
The inventory system sort of needs an overhaul in general. The devs have made some good strides toward making it easier to use (I really like the "advanced" inventory management) but it's still just a bit too clunky. I feel like having an option to sort items alphabetically within each category would be nice, as well as the ability to do a kind of ctrl+f (find on page) within your inventory, which will cease displaying any items that don't have the characters you input into the search bar.

Other than that, I don't know how else to make it easier to use. Maybe implement scrolling around the inventory with the arrow keys and using Page Up and Page Down to jump between item categories?
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: aiwant2tc on June 18, 2013, 12:56:16 PM
Haha Yeah, as long as their is a better way for Stacking Items of different qualities.
Maybe, say you have d-Spear and i-Cracked Spear
Instead just d-Spear and when selected it comes up with a new menu
[Spear]
a-Spear
b-Cracked Spear

Something like that maybe? So slect spear then select the one of a specific quality afterwards?
Ah... I think, that way you wouldn't know whether you have good items or bad in your "spear" category until you select them. Anyway, even if the category is named by the worst/best item, it's not good also, in my opinion - not informative.

Though, I like the Nighthawk's idea about scrolling (with sorting things alphabetically & by categories) and finding items in inventory.
But that way we would need other hotkey-alternative, than "reassign" key option. It may be something like "assign". And some sort of hotkeys...Similliar to e.g. "smash" button, when a "choose where to smash" prompts.
e.g, you press _ " _ in your inventory, all letters in you inventory list dissappear and instead them you have hotkey letters (like in options menu).
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: Dzlan on June 18, 2013, 08:55:17 PM
To be honest, I feel that having pages like in Dwarf Fortress, where on the first page, everything is a-z then second page everything is again lettered a-z
Would simply solve the lack of characters.
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: vultures on June 19, 2013, 01:39:26 AM
This is something I just have to write, for it let me hang for all I care.
If there is an alpha game dev, now branched into boards, dev gits and such, there's oughta be some dissipation onto a main code aim, a final solution pushed towards final build. So don't expect coding to be right at-present; anticipate features rather than extended "wish-for" implementations regarding crucial features. Everything, I mean literally every damn thing about general inventory display and item creation gave problems since early (final) 0.5 and will, I'm certain.
This statement ends my "what's important" skill implement on this board, as some of us are unable to comprehend the highlights of early PC game build-up in object programming.
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: Nighthawk on June 19, 2013, 03:55:05 AM
This is something I just have to write, for it let me hang for all I care.
If there is an alpha game dev, now branched into boards, dev gits and such, there's oughta be some dissipation onto a main code aim, a final solution pushed towards final build. So don't expect coding to be right at-present; anticipate features rather than extended "wish-for" implementations regarding crucial features. Everything, I mean literally every damn thing about general inventory display and item creation gave problems since early (final) 0.5 and will, I'm certain.
This statement ends my "what's important" skill implement on this board, as some of us are unable to comprehend the highlights of early PC game build-up in object programming.

So basically, in layman's terms, you're saying that we're going to get a bunch of content first, and then polish later.
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: Dzlan on June 19, 2013, 07:53:16 AM
The thing is... Content will always be added. As long as the game is worked on. There won't be an end to that, so you can't really wait until there is enough content before polishing (because when is that) besides, there is already a lot of content.
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: vultures on June 19, 2013, 06:52:52 PM
Well, just type in the git's address, and see it for yourselves - just how much pushes and pulls are there at present. Do you want 'em all to be compatible, pro-current, and being developed at the same time? Then eat that pie, and dance as the Radio Bear does. :-)
I'm just sorry GlyphGryph's suggestion over modding engine/automation didn't work out, in my own newb comprehension - maybe it was too early for that also?
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: Dzlan on June 19, 2013, 08:28:36 PM
Then again, which each updates, the GUI and Game do get better ;)
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: Stevensonz on June 19, 2013, 09:12:48 PM
How much performance increase does the SDL version improve over the standard one? (SDL content would be the same as the nightly-build right?) playing from a high end computer that can make 3D movies/animation can't really feel or distinguish lag anymore other than occasional game freezing because of something in-game or crashes from infinite-loops (example too many cop-bots on you then they bump to each other trying to get at you then crash the game.)
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: Máté on June 19, 2013, 09:36:55 PM
You know, in the normal version when you are driving a car and holding down 5 it takes a bit between every turn. Now in this version it doesn't.
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: Stevensonz on June 19, 2013, 09:44:27 PM
I'm playing the nightly build and updating via github, not so sure about that one as everytime I press accelerate and press 5 it moves with current speed and high accelerated speeds give insane distance movement in single key press with cruise control on.
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: Máté on June 19, 2013, 10:01:39 PM
Yeah, sometimes it's so fast I can't keep up with it, but I like it.
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: timtek on June 20, 2013, 01:34:12 AM
My pc isn't exactly the greatest but I noticed that running feels a lot faster in the sdl version.
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: Squirrel on June 20, 2013, 02:59:15 PM
Hmm, getting a bug with this version. My character currently has ~20 volume he can carry total, most of which is currently filled up. So my problem is, if I have picked up something in my hands that can't fit in my inventory, I can't drop it onto another tile. As in, for example -

I have a jerrycan with gasoline that I want to drop of in my truck's trunk , I press  "D", select where I want to drop it, but it prompts saying that "No space in inventory for your jerrycan of gasoline, do you want to drop it? Y/N'". So I press Y, and it drops it below me, not to the designated space. Alright, no biggie, I step on the trunk, repeat, but it gets dropped below it, as in, not in the trunk. So my vehicle moves forward, yet the jerrycan stays behind.

This only happens with items that I can't fit into my inventory. It seems it's going the route of - Take off hands > put in inventory > Drop.

Either I've missed something, or this is a bug. Assuming anyone can even decipher what I just said.


Other than that - Great release, works really, really smoothly.
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: 100Rads on June 20, 2013, 03:31:01 PM
Your trunk is probably full and you cant put anymore things in it.
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: Kevin Granade on June 20, 2013, 04:19:10 PM
Hmm, getting a bug with this version. My character currently has ~20 volume he can carry total, most of which is currently filled up. So my problem is, if I have picked up something in my hands that can't fit in my inventory, I can't drop it onto another tile. As in, for example -

I have a jerrycan with gasoline that I want to drop of in my truck's trunk , I press  "D", select where I want to drop it, but it prompts saying that "No space in inventory for your jerrycan of gasoline, do you want to drop it? Y/N'". So I press Y, and it drops it below me, not to the designated space. Alright, no biggie, I step on the trunk, repeat, but it gets dropped below it, as in, not in the trunk. So my vehicle moves forward, yet the jerrycan stays behind.

This only happens with items that I can't fit into my inventory. It seems it's going the route of - Take off hands > put in inventory > Drop.

Either I've missed something, or this is a bug. Assuming anyone can even decipher what I just said.

Thanks for reporting it.  It's a bug, it's addressed :D
Though I think it's not merged yet.
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: vultures on June 21, 2013, 02:13:11 AM
Yes, forgot to mention that the adventure of playing the official SDL build for windows on an old computer turned out really well. I had 50+ opponents, car/chassis collisions and with infrastructures, multiple times - it all went about 150% faster than before and there were no redraws/slowdowns.
I'm testing SDL 2.0 myself on my own terms and I can tell you, it's even faster - that is, if you don't use OpenGL for 2D.
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: assviberator on June 21, 2013, 08:30:02 AM
how does the fast learner trait  interacts with the new foucs system

am not sure how does the foucs system works in the first place but am assuming it is percantage of the total skill gained from an action example(when foucs is 50% and u get 10 u actually get 5 and this 5 is deducted from your total foucs) please corrcet me if am wrong.
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: Narc on June 22, 2013, 06:57:25 AM
how does the fast learner trait  interacts with the new foucs system
Fast Learner gives you an extra 20% effective focus when learning by doing -- i.e. any learning outside of reading books.
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: Pthalocy on June 25, 2013, 06:12:51 AM
Quote
Quote
So, what you're saying is the DEBUG menu causes a game-crashing BUG. Oh, the irony...

Yep, did it again. Running the Windows SDL version this time. Windows 7, 64-bit.

Debug list causes a fatal exception right when I scroll down to purifier (was hovering over Purse when it quit).

Heh. Amusing.

Quoting self from another thread, put my report in the wrong section. Happened with the version of the build I downloaded just this evening.

Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: youtoo on June 28, 2013, 04:47:33 PM
played old and new version on windows. i never noticed speed issues on windows on the old version. did other people? I have an i5 quad core chip and tons of ram. im not sure how much power tihs game uses. it didnt seem like alot.
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: Zireael on July 01, 2013, 05:37:30 PM
Is the experimental newer than 0.6?
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: darth_servo on July 01, 2013, 09:11:12 PM
Is the experimental newer than 0.6?

Yes, it has the absolute latest code changes.
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: Zireael on July 02, 2013, 08:22:40 AM
The link in OP says "0.5", that's why I'm wondering.
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: i2amroy on July 03, 2013, 03:55:54 AM
Yeah that's a mistake. I've sent a message out to GlyphGryph, who will hopefully get around to fixing it sometime soon. For now the easiest way is simply to download from the main page.
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: Dzlan on July 04, 2013, 07:42:28 AM
I just downloaded the SDL again... (Time for an update) and yet... Why is the font so weird now.
I understand things changed when the SDL came out... but now... I go from 0.6-116 (or something) to nows and the font is really screwed up...
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: nickk on July 11, 2013, 05:33:36 PM
Performance in the latest windows SDL experimental build (downloaded last night) seems to be a lot worse than the version from 30/06. Just creating a new character and running around I move a lot slower. Given how much travelling is involved in the game, that's annoying enough for me to choose the older version.

Specifically, the 30/06 one reads version 0.6.187-g1fcae4b
The latest one is 0.6-450-g44eaf8e
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: Zireael on July 11, 2013, 05:37:27 PM
The only performance problem I have (with all builds I tried, including the 0.6) is a slight hang-up the moment my sleepy time goes past 6 AM.
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: nickk on July 11, 2013, 05:58:34 PM
That's nice for you.
I just timed running 10 map squares by holding down the direction key through fields with a new world and char on the new version - can't give an exact time because it took a second or so to switch to another window to start & stop the timer, but it finished at 17.8 seconds so I guess around 1.6 secs/square after taking that off.
Same test in the old version - I'd kept my old folder. The map meant I could only run 9 squares, but it came in at just over 9 seconds and that's including the start/stop times. So, around 1 sec/square.
Both characters were identical (I just took the default without spending any points).
The difference is very visible to the eye. After playing the old version it feels like running through treacle. I've now tried 3 times with reset worlds so I think it's something with the version rather than a problem particular to one generated world.
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: darth_servo on July 11, 2013, 09:18:02 PM
Performance in the latest windows SDL experimental build (downloaded last night) seems to be a lot worse than the version from 30/06. Just creating a new character and running around I move a lot slower. Given how much travelling is involved in the game, that's annoying enough for me to choose the older version.

Specifically, the 30/06 one reads version 0.6.187-g1fcae4b
The latest one is 0.6-450-g44eaf8e

There does seem to be a distinct difference in speed, from earlier SDL builds, but I don't personally see too much of a slowdown. 

I wonder, does the 30/06 build include the autopickup feature?
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: nickk on July 12, 2013, 12:41:28 AM
It doesn't seem to have autopickup - at least it doesn't appear in the options menu.
I didn't change the default setting for autopickup on the newer version though and the options menu has "Enable item auto pickup" as false. That said, I have no idea how much code still runs for autopickup when it's disabled.

Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: youtoo on July 12, 2013, 06:57:38 PM
have people had performance issues on windows before SDL? I never did. just curious. My understanding is that SDL is supposed to make the game run faster.
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: vultures on July 17, 2013, 01:14:58 PM
There were some words on it past the 0.5 builds; it's that the linux game with ncurses had a significant edge over the native windows renderer, so a faster one was introduced.
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: Deon on September 06, 2013, 11:46:06 AM
There's a big problem: apparently blood shows on top of corpses.

Also the blue background for "multiple items" is not shown. Is it possible to add an "animation" tile which would show that there are more than 1 item on a tile? I am thinking of + and ++ for many items in a corner, I used to do it this way in the old Gremour's tileset version.
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: GalenEvil on September 06, 2013, 11:56:43 AM
@Deon: yeah, I can add that. I will also add a check for corpses into the field/item drawing code.
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: vultures on September 07, 2013, 01:13:42 AM
Oh, I wanted to put in a few words about that to the dev who's killing with the tilesets. :-)
I've looked over the work you've put in, and it seems to me they're shapely, rather than descriptive (and there's resolution, too). So I want to propose to you that you consider making several tiles for item stacks that will essentially depict a Box Item. I'm sure you've familiar with those that are used for moving stuff - in offices, for storing items from home into your car's trunk, etc. You might wanna look in the possibility beyond "stacked" simplicity (if you made a Pile Tile, even if it's cute 'cuz it rhymes :-) being that of a "perky" item or it's upper part as seen in a box; for ex. if there are many clothing items on the street, you could draw some sleeves hanging from the box, or if there's a smashed fridge in the store with many bottles, you draw the top of a bottle that would "stick out". So basically, you could look into types of items, and ask that they are coded in by their number in the mentioned stack. Still, if you draw corpses, and you do for sure, you might wanna have corpse+box tiles; the only flaw I'm able to comprehend because it's even more tiles, and some carcasses have volume big enough to be "top" drawn.

Hope you make something of it. Good Job Nevertheless!
Title: Re: Experimental SDL version uploaded for Windows
Post by: moist_zombie on September 07, 2013, 10:39:31 PM
Hope I'm not throwing this post off its tracks, but tile support could also benefit from screen overlay function, if even possible, could be used for fog and rain and border-effects when taking damage, for hallucinations and buff/debuff stuff, cloud shadows, tint changes brought on by environment (yellow hue for heat, blue for cold/dark, green tint for radioactivity, things like that)..

Not sure how much BRUTAL WORK it'd cause my dear, dear friend GALEN!! *whipcrack!*