Poll

What should be done about the  Irradiated Wanderers situation?

Massively reduce the spawn rate. Everything else is fine.
1 (8.3%)
Give them Z-scientist-like drop tables for books (vault had a library or something).
1 (8.3%)
Give them Z-scientist-like drop tables in general (vault had some rate tech in it).
0 (0%)
Reduce spawn rate AND improve drop table.
3 (25%)
Add some garanteed unique loot to the "finale" of the vault.
6 (50%)
Nothing, working as inteded.
1 (8.3%)

Total Members Voted: 12

Author Topic: Irradiated Wanderers. Spawn density in the vault in particular.  (Read 573 times)

Offline Tamior

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Finally decided to check out the vault in my 0.C-6513 game (with 0.01 item spawning rate and 2.00 Z's spawn rate).

By now I'm somewhere at level 2 of the actual vault, and the kill counter of Irradiated Wanderers is 1200++

I mean, sure, with a combination of tesla cannon (powered via UPS CMB via internal furnace) and lvl 9 in archery (lvl 10 by now, was lvl 9 when I entered) I can probably take 1000's more, but this is getting absurd.

My problem is, to explore the vault that is effectively EMPTY (as compared to a lab, for example) you need to take down 1000's of IW's, and they don't even have a CHANCE to drop anything interesting.
Most corridors in there are just completely red with blood at this point, and the only good drops are from the few odd robots in the robotics bay.

Anyone else feels that either the spawn density for Irradiated Wanderers should be WAY lower, or they need to have a chance to drop at least books (if not some rare stuff directly)?


P.S. Maybe I am missing something here? Vaults have some guaranteed grand finale that makes it worthwhile?
« Last Edit: July 01, 2017, 02:27:44 PM by Tamior »

Offline Alec White

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Offline Tamior

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Re: Irradiated Wanderers. Spawn density in the vault in particular.
« Reply #2 on: July 01, 2017, 04:02:47 PM »
Yea, the absurd part is, with tesla cannon (or chain lighting CBM) and reasonable power levels (3000+ ) you can take those mobs pretty easy. But it's just MOB after MOB after MOB.
I mean, on this pic there are, what, 50 of them? And we are talking 1000's per vault even at 1.00 spawn rate.

Again, the sheer NUMBERS are fine by me. It actually makes the vault different from most other places, for one.
The problems is, there is no incentive to fight them. If they actually had a chance to drop some rare books, now that would be different. Or if they guarded something unique and usefull.
« Last Edit: July 01, 2017, 04:06:54 PM by Tamior »

Offline Azrad

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Re: Irradiated Wanderers. Spawn density in the vault in particular.
« Reply #3 on: July 01, 2017, 04:07:31 PM »
Why, yes, I do agree that there's too many of them.


(posted this on Reddit, and seems like it was mentioned on that Github page). All those irridated wanderers are in the area of just one vault. With only .5 item spawn, all I got there that wasn't a drop from one of the wanderers is a chain lightning bionic and some food items. And a flyer for a vault.

Anyway, as you can see, there's around 12,000+ irridated wanderers on 5x spawn.
« Last Edit: July 01, 2017, 04:11:11 PM by Azrad »
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Offline Tamior

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Re: Irradiated Wanderers. Spawn density in the vault in particular.
« Reply #4 on: July 01, 2017, 04:20:51 PM »
Ok, so the question is, what would be preferable:
- tune down the spawn rate (10 times or even more)
OR
- give them a more diverse drop table (akin to a zombie scientist in terms of books, for example) ?

Offline Fris0uman

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Re: Irradiated Wanderers. Spawn density in the vault in particular.
« Reply #5 on: July 01, 2017, 05:51:15 PM »
I haven't even found a vault yet, but last time I tried to search the sewer for an entry it  just crashed the game, twice...
Just exploring the city above the vault is made extremly annoying by the constante noise.

 By the way should sound be that loud at the surface ? It's weird that you can hear zombies knocking down furniture 2(?) levels below you.

Offline Tamior

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Re: Irradiated Wanderers. Spawn density in the vault in particular.
« Reply #6 on: July 01, 2017, 06:40:55 PM »
I haven't even found a vault yet, but last time I tried to search the sewer for an entry it  just crashed the game, twice...
Just exploring the city above the vault is made extremly annoying by the constante noise.

 By the way should sound be that loud at the surface ? It's weird that you can hear zombies knocking down furniture 2(?) levels below you.
I'm pretty sure that only happens if you use experimental Z-levels.

Offline deoxy

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Re: Irradiated Wanderers. Spawn density in the vault in particular.
« Reply #7 on: July 01, 2017, 08:21:47 PM »
Besides the utterly ridiculous IW count (where did they all come from?!?), there's also the general issue with the way stuff is generated vs what happens to them the moment you show up.

In the vault, there should be nothing left for them to destroy (either able or able to get to) long before you get there.  Generate the area, let it run for several days, then go look at what's there, and make THAT be what's generated to start with the in future.

The current system work fine for the area you start in, but when it's been a year, that new area you go to shouldn't look like the area you started in when you started in it, it should look a lot like the area you started in does NOW - the zombies should have beaten most vehicles to death, and there definitely should be any cars with their engines running (those left running would have plenty of battery and no gas at this point).
This is the text that goes under the post, and there ^ is the post, so this is where it goes.

Offline Lesseps

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Re: Irradiated Wanderers. Spawn density in the vault in particular.
« Reply #8 on: July 01, 2017, 08:33:17 PM »
Quote
Why, yes, I do agree that there's too many of them.
Azrad, what the heck man, 999 sheep??

Offline Azrad

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Re: Irradiated Wanderers. Spawn density in the vault in particular.
« Reply #9 on: July 01, 2017, 08:39:18 PM »
Er, that's for shady zombies. Killed only 4 sheep. Well, at the time, at least. Pretty sure my survivor killed a lot more.

Gotta get them wool staples. For hoarding!
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Offline Tamior

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Re: Irradiated Wanderers. Spawn density in the vault in particular.
« Reply #10 on: July 01, 2017, 09:12:31 PM »
Added a poll to see what would be the preferred solution.

Offline zombiechow

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Re: Irradiated Wanderers. Spawn density in the vault in particular.
« Reply #11 on: July 01, 2017, 09:48:59 PM »
I kind of like the excessive amounts of enemies. It's a unique situation you don't get anywhere else in the game. I say keep the spawn rate the same, but like it was suggested in the opening post add better loot guaranteed at the end.. something to make actually fighting past all those zeds worthwhile.

Offline Tamior

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Re: Irradiated Wanderers. Spawn density in the vault in particular.
« Reply #12 on: July 01, 2017, 10:08:28 PM »
I kind of like the excessive amounts of enemies. It's a unique situation you don't get anywhere else in the game. I say keep the spawn rate the same, but like it was suggested in the opening post add better loot guaranteed at the end.. something to make actually fighting past all those zeds worthwhile.
Well, the problem here is: it's MUCH more labor-intensive. One would need to actually create and implement the "finale" to the vault, think of appropriate loot generation rules to make it reasonable, but desirable,  then make sure it's actually generated properly and is reachable (say hello to "all down staircases blocked" and "lava rift replaced your finale").
Pretty much anyone can tune down the spawn rate or copy/paste better loot table for the IW's. Proper finale with loot, however, it much less straight forward.
« Last Edit: July 01, 2017, 10:10:24 PM by Tamior »

Offline Azrad

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Re: Irradiated Wanderers. Spawn density in the vault in particular.
« Reply #13 on: July 02, 2017, 04:48:16 AM »
I kind of like the excessive amounts of enemies. It's a unique situation you don't get anywhere else in the game. I say keep the spawn rate the same, but like it was suggested in the opening post add better loot guaranteed at the end.. something to make actually fighting past all those zeds worthwhile.

Main problem is that it's just plain tedious and not really hard at all... well, the latter depends on what you got on your survivor. Like, had encountered a horde of around 100-200 zombies once. All the varied enemies create some level of difficulty compared to 1000 irridated wanderers crammed into a corridor. The roaming robots in the deepest level of the vault isn't even an issue, since by the time I reach them they're either out of bullets or flat out destroyed.

Even getting surrounded by irridated wanderers isn't a problem (again, rather subjective), mainly because they only have one notable move - their lunge attack. They don't grab survivors to slow them down.

Plus, ten-thousand plus irridated wanderers lag the game something fierce.
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Offline Tamior

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Re: Irradiated Wanderers. Spawn density in the vault in particular.
« Reply #14 on: July 10, 2017, 10:57:18 AM »
What's the current status of the vault production in general?
From what I can tell, it's FIXED layout dungeon (rotation is possible) that never spawns level 3 and below (all stairs down on second level are always blocked).
And the loot tables for the rooms that do spawn on the level 1-2 are "meh" at best.