Author Topic: New vehicle construction system explained  (Read 89017 times)

Offline Kevin Granade

  • Administrator
  • Survivor
  • *****
  • Posts: 5238
  • I code dead people.
    • View Profile
Re: New vehicle construction system explained
« Reply #15 on: October 16, 2013, 05:16:17 PM »
I always took armor to be "armor whatever is there", so it should block neither sight nor movement*, whatever the underlying component is should determine whether sight or movement are blocked.  The excption being windhields, they should need special measures to preserve transparency when armored.

No, you can't install wheels in a space without a frame anymore.

*I have no idea if it actually works this way.
Its like a fun family cookout, except your family is burning in flames while trying to eat you. -secretfire
I'm more excited than a survivor on meth and toast'ems. -Nighthawk
The the giant wasp is slammed through the zombie brute!

Offline EkarusRyndren

  • Survivor
  • ***
  • Posts: 2270
  • I will live forever because I am 45% preservative
    • View Profile
    • My Tumblr
Re: New vehicle construction system explained
« Reply #16 on: October 16, 2013, 05:21:15 PM »
I always took armor to be "armor whatever is there", so it should block neither sight nor movement*, whatever the underlying component is should determine whether sight or movement are blocked.  The excption being windhields, they should need special measures to preserve transparency when armored.

No, you can't install wheels in a space without a frame anymore.

*I have no idea if it actually works this way.

In the previous builds that's pretty much the way it worked (I think) with a few exceptions on things that wouldn't be easily armored without causing issues with the component (Windows, Solar panels, etc) Personally I liked it when it worked this way, now I have to choose between armoring my vehicle had being 'hidden' in the back while trying to wait out the daylight... Though I don't need glass for windows anymore, which makes my life a lot easier XD
But then deafness, yes. I forgot about deafness. It would be deafness with a :( face though.

Offline GlyphGryph

  • Administrator
  • Survivor
  • *****
  • Posts: 1488
  • Kreaaaaa
    • View Profile
Re: New vehicle construction system explained
« Reply #17 on: October 16, 2013, 06:04:36 PM »
Yeah, either it needs to block sight, or it needs to NOT block movement.

Offline Ian Strachan

  • NPC
  • **
  • Posts: 192
    • View Profile
Re: New vehicle construction system explained
« Reply #18 on: October 16, 2013, 06:27:28 PM »
Plating was changed to block movement and take up space like most other parts as a simpler alternative to the old system - parts were randomly flagged "NO_REINFORCE" (without much thought -  you could reinforce a seat, but not a kitchen unit) and you had no way to know this except trial and error (or reading the json files).

It also didn't work, because while you couldn't install plating over a NO_REINFORCE part, you could put the part over the plating and that was allowed. Putting armor in its own slot would necessitate the return of the NO_REINFORCE flag.

An armored bumper is a more reasonable way to look at it, particularly since there are flavors like spiked plating available that are supposed to collide with zombies before other stuff does.

They could easily be made opaque, but that would make them inferior to boards. Not blocking movement (much like armoring a frame in the old version) helps with collisions, but not with zombies trying to break inside.



As for wheels in an empty space: nope. Everything except spikes/blades needs a frame first.
« Last Edit: October 16, 2013, 06:29:28 PM by Ian Strachan »

Offline Kevin Granade

  • Administrator
  • Survivor
  • *****
  • Posts: 5238
  • I code dead people.
    • View Profile
Re: New vehicle construction system explained
« Reply #19 on: October 16, 2013, 07:06:18 PM »
Plating was changed to block movement and take up space like most other parts as a simpler alternative to the old system - parts were randomly flagged "NO_REINFORCE" (without much thought -  you could reinforce a seat, but not a kitchen unit) and you had no way to know this except trial and error (or reading the json files).
Taking up a slot yes, blocking movement is orthoganal to that, right?
They could easily be made opaque, but that would make them inferior to boards. Not blocking movement (much like armoring a frame in the old version) helps with collisions, but not with zombies trying to break inside.
Yea, it doesn't help with keeping zombies out, it's not supposed to, it's just supposed to protect the parts that DO keep zombies out.

This sounds like an easy fix, remove movement blocking from armor, and update vehicle designs to have boards, doors, or windshields where they want to block movement.  I'm pretty sure that's what's intended.
Its like a fun family cookout, except your family is burning in flames while trying to eat you. -secretfire
I'm more excited than a survivor on meth and toast'ems. -Nighthawk
The the giant wasp is slammed through the zombie brute!

Offline EkarusRyndren

  • Survivor
  • ***
  • Posts: 2270
  • I will live forever because I am 45% preservative
    • View Profile
    • My Tumblr
Re: New vehicle construction system explained
« Reply #20 on: October 16, 2013, 08:42:30 PM »
Personally, I'd love it if windows were switched to the lines that glass walls use, the " bugs me when it rotates... XD

But that's just me
But then deafness, yes. I forgot about deafness. It would be deafness with a :( face though.

Offline i2amroy

  • Contributor
  • Survivor
  • ****
  • Posts: 2757
  • Cats, ruling the world one dwarf at a time
    • View Profile
Re: New vehicle construction system explained
« Reply #21 on: October 16, 2013, 08:51:56 PM »
Personally, I'd love it if windows were switched to the lines that glass walls use, the " bugs me when it rotates... XD
That might not be that bad of an idea, I've always found the " a little annoying myself.

Offline Blaze

  • Survivor
  • ***
  • Posts: 635
    • View Profile
Re: New vehicle construction system explained
« Reply #22 on: October 16, 2013, 09:45:34 PM »
You can always mod it.

Offline Ian Strachan

  • NPC
  • **
  • Posts: 192
    • View Profile
Re: New vehicle construction system explained
« Reply #23 on: October 16, 2013, 10:54:03 PM »
This sounds like an easy fix, remove movement blocking from armor, and update vehicle designs to have boards, doors, or windshields where they want to block movement.  I'm pretty sure that's what's intended.

The only vehicles that comes with armor are the quad bike (one piece on the front), the military truck (across the front), and the armored car (all around the exterior).

If it's fine to prevent other stuff going in that slot, then it just takes removing the "OBSTACLE" flag from plating in vehicle_parts.json to remedy this.

Offline meowmers

  • Zombie Food
  • *
  • Posts: 12
    • View Profile
Re: New vehicle construction system explained
« Reply #24 on: October 17, 2013, 01:22:59 AM »
what about making steel plating only Impassable and then making cars out of steel plating over frames. kinda like how they are in real life. then you could use Boards to  block vision and movement, like the walls on an RV. Finally using Hard Plating as the additional armor.

Frames like the current version (like the skeleton of the vehicle)
Steel Plating like the currently exist but used on top of Frames to keep stuff out (like the body of cars)
Boards like the current version but used an obstructed alternative to Steel Plating, also allowing armor (like body of some trucks or RVs)
Hard/Spiked/Superalloy Plating as the armor for armored vehicles.
Does that make sense.



Offline EkarusRyndren

  • Survivor
  • ***
  • Posts: 2270
  • I will live forever because I am 45% preservative
    • View Profile
    • My Tumblr
Re: New vehicle construction system explained
« Reply #25 on: October 17, 2013, 01:35:46 AM »
I still think the old system worked best as far as armor & boards was concerned something like this (below) would be ideal:

[frame]
-board-
(steel plating)
-headlight-

Anything above (The frame, and board) the Steel plating is "armored" anything below it isn't, merging "Steel plating" and "board" as one object prevents players from being able to melt down other cars to make steel plating to go over other parts.

That said a separate symbol for parts that can't be armored would be nice so that one can know their attempts to armor say a Welding Rig are futile. This also allows for armoring "Hoods" of vehicles without blocking LoS or making the area impassable.
But then deafness, yes. I forgot about deafness. It would be deafness with a :( face though.

Offline meowmers

  • Zombie Food
  • *
  • Posts: 12
    • View Profile
Re: New vehicle construction system explained
« Reply #26 on: October 17, 2013, 01:48:48 AM »
I still think the old system worked best as far as armor & boards was concerned something like this (below) would be ideal:

[frame]
-board-
(steel plating)
-headlight-

Anything above (The frame, and board) the Steel plating is "armored" anything below it isn't, merging "Steel plating" and "board" as one object prevents players from being able to melt down other cars to make steel plating to go over other parts.

That said a separate symbol for parts that can't be armored would be nice so that one can know their attempts to armor say a Welding Rig are futile. This also allows for armoring "Hoods" of vehicles without blocking LoS or making the area impassable.
that does not solve the problem of not having to use car doors. If there existed another thing like Boards but only impassible for cars to be made out of.

Offline EkarusRyndren

  • Survivor
  • ***
  • Posts: 2270
  • I will live forever because I am 45% preservative
    • View Profile
    • My Tumblr
Re: New vehicle construction system explained
« Reply #27 on: October 17, 2013, 01:52:06 AM »
I still think the old system worked best as far as armor & boards was concerned something like this (below) would be ideal:

[frame]
-board-
(steel plating)
-headlight-

Anything above (The frame, and board) the Steel plating is "armored" anything below it isn't, merging "Steel plating" and "board" as one object prevents players from being able to melt down other cars to make steel plating to go over other parts.

That said a separate symbol for parts that can't be armored would be nice so that one can know their attempts to armor say a Welding Rig are futile. This also allows for armoring "Hoods" of vehicles without blocking LoS or making the area impassable.
that does not solve the problem of not having to use car doors. If there existed another thing like Boards but only impassible for cars to be made out of.

Correct me if I'm wrong on this but the front end of a "car" is something like this:
0""0

Right? Why not put windshield over the tires? I think I did that to fix a bus' "holes" once
But then deafness, yes. I forgot about deafness. It would be deafness with a :( face though.

Offline meowmers

  • Zombie Food
  • *
  • Posts: 12
    • View Profile
Re: New vehicle construction system explained
« Reply #28 on: October 17, 2013, 04:07:08 AM »
Correct me if I'm wrong on this but the front end of a "car" is something like this:
0""0

Right? Why not put windshield over the tires? I think I did that to fix a bus' "holes" once
thats what i do now. i really dont mind the system thats in place now but my  ride has become this:

(click to show/hide)

and im not sure if that armor layer does anything.

Offline youtoo

  • Survivor
  • ***
  • Posts: 943
    • View Profile
Re: New vehicle construction system explained
« Reply #29 on: October 17, 2013, 05:12:06 PM »
can this be stickied? we should move it to the wiki.